Peter Meijer has served his country as a member of the US Army Reserves and then as part of Team Rubicon. He has continued his service as a Congressman for Michigan’s Third District.
William Krieger
The views and opinions of the guests of the Me You Us podcast do not represent the views and opinions of Consumers Energy. Hello, everyone and welcome to Me You Us, a wellbeing podcast. It’s another wellbeing Wednesday here at Consumers Energy. And I’m your host Bill Krieger. Today my guest is Peter Meijer. He’s a representative for Michigan’s third district. So Representative Meijer, if you’d introduce yourself, we’ll get the conversation started.
Peter Meijer
Thank you, Bill. I’m Peter Meijer. I represent Michigan’s third district, as you mentioned, I’m a freshman member of Congress. And also, prior to running for office, I had served in the military was deployed to Iraq with the US Army, I had worked overseas in humanitarian aid in places like the Philippines, and then also in conflict analysis in Afghanistan. So kind of had been around the world and back again, and then ran for office, and then proud to be serving my first term on the homeland security, foreign affairs and science space and technology committees.
William Krieger
So a lot of stuff for a young guy to have accomplished in a very short period of time. It’s a pretty impressive record. And, you know, as we were talking before the show, I talked about this, this lifetime of service that many of our representatives, Congressman, senators, have done a lot of military veterans in that space, as well. So I wanted to talk to you a little bit about that. But before we kind of get to that, I’d like to know what was it like growing up as Peter Meijer? What kind of things did you do as a kid? And in how did you sort of get interested in the military, I know that you joined shortly after high school.
Peter Meijer
So I think, you know, 911 occurred while I was in middle school. And even prior to that, I had always wanted to join the military, it was kind of a far off, you know, aspiration as an elementary school kid, and as a middle schooler. I don’t know when that really clicked, you know, but I knew that service and specifically military service, something I want it to be part of my story. And part of, you know, what, I was kind of being developed in and developing, you know, as part of that experience. So, initially, that meant, you know, going to West Point where I left after where I went after high school, love the military was not, was not exactly sure that I wanted a career as A. you know, someone on active duty and, you know, B. somebody who was, you know, an officer, as intelligence was a little bit more of my passion. So I ended up transferring out after a year and then enlisting in the reserves where, you know, I was able to do the intelligence work a bit more concrete. But I think it’s that, that general feeling of being in the arena, and not liking sitting on the sidelines while somebody else is out, you know, in in the fight or in the game, or, you know, in the in the scrum.
William Krieger
Well, that’s interesting that you say that, because I actually spent most of my career in the military, I retired back in 2010, as an enlisted person, so I was a staff sergeant in the Army, but at about 14 years, I decided to go to Officer Candidate School, for the exact same reasons that you kind of switched over to the enlisted Corps. I felt me personally, I felt like I wasn’t able to make those decisions that I felt needed to be made. And so I got my commission, prior to going over to Iraq. So it’s an interesting kind of two different outcomes, but really, for the same purpose.
Peter Meijer
And I think that’s something that a lot of the civilian community doesn’t understand how diverse you know; the military is in terms of the roles and responsibilities and realities. And something that always kind of cracks me up is, you know, deploying to Iraq as a, as an E -5 sergeant, doing intelligence work, you know, I was high enough ranking, that if I was dropped on some small little base, some little outpost or, or kind of joint base with the Iraqis, that if I’m walking around, and some Sergeant Major sees me, I’m high enough ranking that he assumes I know what I’m doing and that I have a reason to be there, but I’m low enough ranking that he didn’t really need to know why I was there. You know, so your kind of were above the below but below the upper and at the same time carrying a different type of pistol with a different type of patch. You know, my hair is within regs, but like obeying the letter of the regulations, maybe not the Spirit, you know, so the combination of all of that, but that those type of nuances, I think or you’re laughing at that. But I think a lot of maybe potentially civilian listeners, you wouldn’t really understand the dramatic freedom of expression implied there.
William Krieger
Yeah, absolutely. And you know, even as an officer, I walked around in fear of many Sergeants Major. So yeah, for the for the military folks out there, you’ll, you’ll totally get it and there is kind of that sweet spot, whether it’s enlisted or in the officer ranks where you have a lot of things that you can do and a lot of latitude simply because of where you sit in that hierarchy. So I completely get it. And I love what you said about keeping your hair to the letter, if not the spirit, I know, a lot of my peers, when we were deployed, probably didn’t keep their hair cut to either and met with the wrath of a sergeant major or two. So you, so you did us served in Iraq, you came home, you finished out your education. But you know, when I look at the things that you’ve done, you continued your service, I know with groups like Team Rubicon, and some of those things. And here’s the interesting thing. I’ve heard of Team Rubicon, and some friends of mine have done some work with them here stateside. But I did not realize all the work that they do worldwide until I really took a look at their website. So can you talk a little bit about what drew you into Team Rubicon and some of the things you did there?
Peter Meijer
Yeah, absolutely. You know, when I came back from Iraq, this was, you know, mid to late 2011. You know, I still had a year to finish up of college, but I was on the board of directors of Student Veterans of America, and that was a pretty heady time in the veterans community, because you had the large, you know, that kind of the surge era, you know, cohort, just coming out of the military or going through school or just graduating from college, you know, so it’s a pretty transformational time, you know, as that group that has signed up, you know, on or around 911, either were finishing an eight year enlistment, you know, or were finishing had finished their enlistment. And then were rotating out of college, right. So there’s a pretty big cohort. And both on the Student Veterans of America side of the house, the one of the goals there was that we succeeded, and I’m campaigning to get the post 911 GI bill passed, to get those folks who are transitioning out to get them through higher education and on a pathway to career success. But then, on the general, you know, nonprofit side of the house, it was also how do we take this fantastic resource, this veteran community, and you apply it to a notion of continuing service. And I think we see that, you know, Team Rubicon was a great group that I was introduced to roughly a year after it started. And I remember hearing about it, and it’s like, oh, you take military veterans, and, you know, have them respond to natural disasters, kind of drop them in the middle of a place where they can figure their way, you know, through sanity. And I was like, oh, that makes…that is the most perfectly obvious, greatest idea. And so had the opportunity to, I had, I’d been a volunteer EMT, you know, in college, I obviously, had, you know, was, thanks to all my military experiences, it was the type of person you could just kind of plop down in a random place, and I’m going to be able to figure things out. And so had the opportunity to go with them to South Sudan. And I mean, that was as simple as a text message from a buddy that just said, Do you want to go to South Sudan question mark? I just said, yes. I was not a real big, I was like, I trust that I will, I will be told whatever I need to know. And if I’m not told it, either, I don’t need to know it, or my job is to figure it out. Right. And so had a great, great experience over there catching malaria, and then went to the Philippines after Typhoon Haiyan in 2013. Spent some time at Hurricane Sandy when I hit in 2012. So it was just a really exciting time to be at the, at the kind of at the ground level where each mission ended up being the biggest response they had done to date. You know, the Philippines was the largest international response. You know, I think the Team Rubicon had done since Haiti, you know, which was their first mission, Hurricane Sandy was the largest domestic response they had done since Joplin, which was, you know, their first major domestic response. So it was a really exciting moment to be in this community that was just kind of finding its sea legs, but also to kind of show up in a random, you know, disaster struck part of the world and realize like, Oh, you’re all my friends. So it was good. I’d have a wonderful, wonderful thing in the midst of tragedy.
William Krieger
Well, you know, you talked about responding to some of these natural disasters. And, you know, I recall, responding to Hurricane Katrina, getting in a Humvee and driving from Michigan down to Biloxi, Mississippi, the day after. And one of the things is when you get there, you know, I took some pictures and, and you really can’t describe what you see. Did you really find that true? Because when I go back and look at pictures of these disasters that I’ve responded to the pictures don’t even do it justice, like you almost have to be there to really grasp what’s happened.
Peter Meijer
The, you know, there’s something about the atmospherics of a place kind of how it feels, that is really irreplaceable. And that setting aside the obvious, which is, you know, especially in a disaster zone, you know, I mentioned running into my friends in places, you know, and then I also at the same time, realize, wow, you guys smell terrible, because you haven’t had a shower in two weeks. You know, so there’s the, the pungency, you know, of a locale oftentimes doesn’t translate into a photograph, you know, but just especially getting a getting a sense, I mentioned that atmosphere, it’s getting a sense of, of the tension, of the hope, of the fear, you know, kind of the emotions of a place, I think, are really critical, but very easily lost, you know, in a photograph that reduces things down. And, and I think of places that I’ve spent a little bit of time in Ukraine, and actually was spent Fourth of July 2015, I think, in Mariupol, which was after some of the fighting occurred, but it was most of the fighting was occurring a couple of kilometers to the east. And so it’d be, I think I have a decent understanding. And could situate you know what the context is as best as somebody who has never been there. Because at least I’ve been there, even though I have not been there in anything bordering on the current cataclysm, you know. But that having been said, someone who spent one minute on the ground is going to have an infinitely better understanding of that dynamic of that moment, in that reality than I ever would, you know, because I haven’t, I maybe spent a week there, you know, but not there that is right now, right? Maybe that’s a little too ethereal. But there’s no replacing, kind of being, seeing, smelling, hearing, feeling. All of those different, you know, kind of sensory components of a moment.
William Krieger
Well, and too, the other thing I photograph, I don’t think captures is how surprising people are. I know, I remember, you know, vividly being right down at the beachfront in Biloxi. And these houses are completely wiped out if they’re if they’re there at all. And this guy came out of his house, he had on a pair of ripped up shorts, no shirt. And again, you could tell he probably hadn’t showered in at least a few days. And he came out to ask us what he could do for us. And to me, that really kind of brought some hope around the human condition. And I find that when I respond to things, even my comment time in Iraq, people surprised me. It how they really came together reacted, do you find that as well?
Peter Meijer
I do. You know, I think that’s when you really see what a community is made of. And communities that have some underlying trust, you know, that becomes a very easy thing to fall back on. Communities that maybe are lacking that, you know, those fissures in that, that kind of fraying of, of, of social fabric is very evident. But, you know, I’ve always been, you know, overwhelmed, you know, on some of those disaster response missions, you know, how many people you know, were, you just kind of saw some of the best come out of folks. And I think that’s always been a wonderful thing to, to see and then kind of have affirmed, you know, that inherent goodness there.
William Krieger
Yes. And sometimes I think that’s, that’s hard to see. So, you know, as we talk through the things that you’ve done in this lifetime of service I, I’ve got to ask what drew you to becoming a representative and going to Washington? I mean, to me, that’s an extension of service. But what drew you to that after all of these other things that you’ve done?
Peter Meijer
That is a very logical question that I used to have a very good answer for that now I need to rack my brain. Excuse me, and remember, no, I had I, having spent close to three years between Iraq and Afghanistan, you know, as both a combatant and a and a non-combatant, you know, living inside the T walls and live in, you know, out on the economy. You know, I’ve really wanted that perspective to be something that was represented, and, frankly, in Congress. And I think one of my frustrations has been that all too often it feels like that isn’t represented that the that within Congress, there oftentimes isn’t that appreciation that what the government does and what the government doesn’t do, you know, either through action or inaction, you know, lives are going to hang in the balance. And so I wanted to bring the gravity of that perspective, you know, to that office, and also stepping aside from the foreign policy side of the house, or just the maybe mortal consequence side of the house, I wanted to bring a longer-term orientation to a lot of our decision making. Because the other frustration that I had is it seemed to be, we’re barely able to solve it. Well, in the military, right, you have your 50-meter targets, you have your 100-meter targets, the over 200-meter targets, the 300-meter targets. You know, you got to hit the 50-meter targets, because those are the things that are going to run up and stab you if you don’t get them and drop them, you know, but you also can’t forget about the 200-meter and the 300-meter, because those are the ones that are going to come and be the 50 meter if you don’t drop them soon, too. And so we spent all of our time focusing on these 50-meter targets always reacting, and not doing the groundwork so that we don’t have to worry about them, because we’ve taken care of them when they were at that 300- or 200-meter stage.
William Krieger
Well, that’s great perspective. And I liked something else you said, too, is that the decisions to get made by other people impact many, many, many people, especially true in Washington, but it sounds like maybe even a lesson learned in the military. I know that when I made those hard decisions as commander, my enlisted experience taught me to think about the consequences of those decisions and try and make the decisions based on that. And it sounds like maybe you brought some of that into Congress as well.
Peter Meijer
Absolutely. So I mean, that’s I think a pretty big focus is just wanting to have some of that be represented.
William Krieger
So you talked a little bit too, I want to go back, you talked a bit about getting the post 911 GI bill passed, I actually administer our GI Bill program here at Consumers Energy, because our apprentices are sometimes eligible to use their GI Bill benefits. In fact, I think we’re up to about 45 people using those benefits, and I used them myself, I have a master’s degree, thanks to some of that work. But can you talk briefly about maybe some of the other things that are going on in Washington to help our veterans?
Peter Meijer
Yeah, you know, you mentioned obviously, the GI Bill was a massive push, you know, in that 2007 2008 timeframe, so that returning veterans were and Afghanistan had comparable education benefits, as the post-world war two generation had, or as the World War Two generation had when they were returning from the Atlantic or Pacific theatres. So we, we succeeded there, and there’s been some incremental progress since that very transformational legislation. But frankly, where a lot of our focus has been in the, in recent years, has been around toxic exposure, and some of the respiratory ailments associated with burn pits. You know, we’re, you can, you can kind of draw an issue out of the hat, and the VA system probably has it, you know, but when it comes to being focused on what we need to do in order to provide for our veterans, you know, it’s a bit of a whack a mole, where we want to be making sure that on the positive end, that we’re providing, what needs to be provided, and then also covering all of the unanticipated issues that arise. And obviously, when it comes to what is, frankly, the post 911 equivalent to Agent Orange, which is, you know, burn pits in that broader sense of toxic exposure, that we’re doing the identification that we’re getting the presumptive coverage, you know, that we’re making sure that those service related ailments are being viewed as such, and that, you know, members of the military who served overseas and were exposed to be that they are getting the appropriate care and treatment.
William Krieger
You know, last year I attended the VFW national conference. I’m also a member of the National Guard Association United States and they really talk about burn pit and some other things that are impacting our veterans. And one of the things that they bring up quite frequently is that when we are getting ready to go into war or do some sort of operation in another country, we look at the overall cost of doing that, right. You hear a lot of talk of what it costs to be in Iraq or what it cost to be in Afghanistan and so on. But they make this argument that we don’t talk about what the cost is when we come back. And that somehow, we should factor that in, when we’re thinking about sending our young men and women just like we were over into these areas. And what are your thoughts on that?
Peter Meijer
Yeah, well, actually, I’m, I was the co-lead the Republican side of a kind of cost of war piece of legislation, which sought to do just that, which is, you know, let’s have a running tally of all of these expenses? Because it’s important to remember, I think the last Civil War pension was just was, you know, stopped being paid out a couple of years ago, you know, it was, which is bizarre to think how long, you know, the direct financial costs of some of our conflicts are, right, I mean, in this case, it was a very old, old, you know, Civil War veteran who, you know, in his 80s, or 90s, married a very, very young woman, you know, who lived very long, you know. But over that that kind of span, you see, like we are, we were still paying that pension, for somebody who served, you know, 160 years ago, you know. So you can imagine, you know, what legacy costs will still be with us, you know, from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. And I think that’s something that we should be very mindful of prior to, you know, any conflict that we are entering.
William Krieger
I couldn’t agree more. So thank you for answering that question for me. There are two more things I’d like to cover with you before we go, I know we’re coming up on time here. The first one is shifting gears a little bit. I, I read this article about you not liking breakfast, and I think the the exact quote was right around you are militant about not liking breakfast. Could you talk just a little bit about that?
Peter Meijer
Absolutely. I don’t think breakfast is a very good meal category. I fundamentally do not understand the idea that breakfast for dinner is some type of a treat. If anything, it feels like a scam. You know, I mean, I think breakfast. And when I’m thinking of breakfast, there was a lot of individual components of breakfast that I enjoy at many times of the day, right? Cereal, no issue with cereal, love cereal, you know, a Special K, Chex, great. I actually really like eggs in a cocktail, on my burger, right? There’s a lot of great ways that an egg can be presented. But one of the challenges is breakfast is either it’s either salty, greasy, or cheesy, right? That’s kind of all but you only get one or two of those. So it’s a very limited flavor profile. And it’s I think this this, I think, very patronizing idea that your stomach can only take you know, so little early on in the day, and I think that just gives our miraculous bodies short shrift to be honest.
William Krieger
Well, and I think salty, cheesy, and greasy sometimes its very appealing. But I get what you’re saying.
Peter Meijer
Completely more you need the umami, right? You need like the meat, you need something, when even like the meats that you have, are either salty or greasy. Right? They’re never the actual flavor of the meat. You know, it’s just a salty or greasy flavor. No one’s, like even when that steak is served for breakfast. It’s not a good steak, it’s a terrible steak, it’s like the steak that you you’re too embarrassed to serve at dinner, you know, so I just I don’t think the whole thing is a racket.
William Krieger
Well, I can appreciate that. I have to be honest, for breakfast, I am a smoothie guy. I throw a bunch of spinach and some fruit into a blender. And that’s my food. I think breakfast meats are meat in name only. So thanks for entertaining that question. It really, I read it. And I kind of chuckled. So I had to ask. But as I said, we are coming up on time, and I want to be respectful of your schedule as well. But before we go first, let me thank you so much for being on and taking the time out to do this with us. And secondly, what would you like to leave the audience with? What would you like our audience to take away from our conversation today?
Peter Meijer
I think one of the important things for the audience is there’s no or at least one life lesson that I’ve tried to apply that I think is something a lot of folks could stand to hear is, you know, maybe have a plan but be ready to discard that plan. You know, if life throws you something more interesting, you know, and then that general sense of, you know, having a trajectory having a direction but not being so consumed by fidelity to that path, that you disregard opportunities as they come along. You know, I think back to all of the experiences that came about only because, you know, that text message that said, you want to go to South Sudan, if I would have said, No, you know, how different my life would have been, you know, or if I didn’t end up transferring out of West Point, and then didn’t end up going to Iraq before my class would have gone. If I, you know, you can’t know. But I think of all of those scenarios. And, you know, this is the cliche advice, but I’d rather regret the things, you know, I did and the things I didn’t do, but at the same time, you know, I think we live in a very unpredictable and kind of nonlinear moment. And I think it’s beneficial to approach that in a slightly unpredictable and emphatically nonlinear way to kind of seize the opportunities that present themselves rather than, you know, kind of let that call at the door go unanswered.
William Krieger
Well, and I think that really speaks to one of those lessons in the military, right. No plan survives the first shot fired, but you have to have a plan. And also, you know, that text message about going to Sudan, especially about some of the things I’ve done with some of my friends, and it was really summed up I think, greatly by Robert Frost, when he talks about taking that, that road less traveled, right? We have this idea where we want to go but it’s always great to check out some other things because great things may come from, as you know, evidenced in your in your life. So, again, Congressman Meijer, thank you so much for being on the podcast today and taking the time out to talk with me and the audience. And I look forward to talking with you again soon.
Peter Meijer
Thank you, Bill. I really appreciate it. Have a wonderful day.
William Krieger
Thank you to the audience for listening in today. The Me You Us podcast is proudly sponsored by Consumers Energy leaving Michigan better than we found it. Remember, you can find the Me You Us podcast on all major podcasting platforms. So be sure to go out find us and subscribe. If you or someone you know is in crisis, please contact the Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 1-800-273-8255. That’s 1-800-273-8255 If you are a veteran or know a Veteran who is in crisis, you can call 1-800-273-8255 and press one for the Veterans Crisis Line. And remember to tune in every Wednesday, as we talk about the things that impact your personal wellbeing.
